Caulton Tudor

Doeren progress likely but it will be a bumpy ride

Posted August 7, 2014

N.C. State coach Dave Doeren leads his team onto the field for the Wolfpack's visit to Duke on November 9, 2013 in Durham, NC.  Duke defeated N.C. State 38-20 (Photo by Jack Morton).

Although there’s much agreement among N.C. State fans, rival coaches and the regional media that Dave Doeren will have a long, successful stand with the Wolfpack, several ACC coaches who got off to particularly poor starts in the past did not survive.

That’s not really been the case at State, where only one Wolfpack coach since the formation of the ACC had a debut season generally in line with Doeren’s 4-8 overall and 0-8 conference record in 2013.

That was Tom Reed, whose first team (1983) finished 3-8 overall and 1-5 ACC. Reed’s second season was a duplicate of the first and his third – 3-8 overall, 2-5 ACC in 1985 – prompted a switch to Dick Sheridan.

Otherwise, first-year Wolfpack coaches have been relatively successful from the start, even those who wound up getting dismissed – Tom O’Brien (5-7, 3-5 in 2007), Chuck Amato (8-4, 4-4 in 2000), Mike O’Cain (7-5, 4-4 in 1993) and Monte Kiffin (6-5, 3-4 in 1980).

Al Michaels, who went 3-8, 2-4 in 1971, doesn’t count since he was an interim to bridge the retirement of Earle Edwards and the hiring of Lou Holtz.

Doeren’s problems last season are well documented – injuries, patchwork quarterback rotation and an agonizing defensive transition.

Doeren and his players are confident that positives will come from the ordeal of ’13. And on paper, there’s reason to think the offense will be better with new quarterback Jacoby Brissett and the defense will benefit from improved leadership and experience.

“I don’t want it to happen again, but I definitely think we’re a better team for it,” Doeren said.

Team psychology can play a role

According to some other coaches who have been through experiences similar to Doeren’s debut, physical improvement alone isn’t necessarily enough to spark a clear-cut recovery.

At UNC in the late 1980s, Mack Brown pulled off one of the all-time Lazarus coaching acts when his first and second Tar Heel teams went 2-20 overall and 1-13 in ACC games.

Entering the 1990 season, Brown was under relentless criticism from the fan base. So was then Carolina athletic director John Swofford, now ACC commissioner, who had gambled on Brown even though the coach had gone only 6-5 in one season at Appalachian State and 11-23 in three seasons at Tulane.

Brown’s critics didn’t care that his outside schedule those first two seasons included two games against South Carolina and one each against Oklahoma, Auburn, Louisville and Kentucky.

Brown’s third team was better and won three of its first four against a lighter non-league slate that included Miami of Ohio and Connecticut. But a third straight loss to State, 12-9 at Chapel Hill in midseason, led to an explosion of unrest. That Brown would be gone after three seasons was all but a foregone conclusion.

But just two weeks later in Chapel Hill, Brown’s career turned dramatically thanks to a 13-13 tie against a Georgia Tech team that would a share of the national title and finish 11-0-1.

“It was all about getting enough confidence in ourselves,” Brown reflected on his third season. “Until that game against Georgia Tech, we thought we could be good program, but we hadn’t done anything to prove it.”

Although that team lost later games to 17th-ranked Clemson and 11th-ranked Virginia, the ’90 Heels finished 6-4-1 (3-3-1) and set the stage for one of the best eras in school history.

Oct. 11 game against BC could be pivotal

Thanks to a much easier non-ACC schedule, Doeren already has doubled Brown’s two-season victory total and four more non-league wins are there for the taking early this season.

But on the psychological/confidence front, 2014 still might be problematic due to uneven nature of that schedule. 

Since the Pack’s first two league games will be against Florida State (Sept. 27 Raleigh) and at Clemson (Oct. 4), it’s possible that Doeren and his players will be into the second half of their schedule before they really have a chance to get a meaningful reading on any second-year progress.

In theory, it’s very possible the Pack’s most important game of the entire season could fall on Oct. 11 against Boston College in Raleigh a week after the trip to Clemson.

It’s not that BC is a power and has much of a chance to become one. In fact, it’s likely State could be favored by a touchdown or more.

But with ensuing games after the Eagles falling on the road against Louisville and Syracuse, the last thing Doeren and his players need would be an 0-3 league start.


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  • ACC4ME Aug 14, 2014

    View quoted thread

    Back peddling from your prediction about State "not winning another ACC game this season", I see.

  • gregoryrjones Aug 14, 2014

    If he doesn't show improvement in wins and losses this year, he might be sown the door before mid season. Like it or not, that is the reality of his situation.

  • vt94hokies Aug 12, 2014

    He's still a relatively young coach, and he's still learning. His judgment on some calls last season were questionable. Just like Frank Beamer in the last 4 years.


    View quoted thread

    Protip: it doesn't count if you're replying to one of your alter-egos.

  • sportznutv2.11 Aug 8, 2014

    View quoted thread


  • nufsaid Aug 7, 2014

    View quoted thread

    I am a pack fan in good times and bad. Must say that Doeren lost a game or two last year by going for it on fourth down when we were backed up on our side of the field. I hope he uses better judgement this year.

  • nnb Aug 7, 2014

    Was at every game last year, home and away - I only remember 3 wins. Thought the article would have been corrected by now. Doeren’s 4-8 overall was 3-9 overall in 2013. 8 conference losses plus ECU arr state loss.

  • TeaBagOnLove Aug 7, 2014

    View quoted thread

    First time that I have heard or read that bold statement. The reality is that NC State football was a complete rebuild BEFORE TOB got the boot. Coach Doeren has never built a team before. Let alone a Program.
    He inherited Jerry Kill's program at NIU and the team did better after he left for NC State. Whether Coach Doeren can build a program and keep the NC State fans at bay long enough before the Boooo Birds call for his exit remains to be seen.

  • A cold, hard dose of Hans Aug 7, 2014

    There is?

  • LuvsThePack Aug 7, 2014

    View quoted thread

    He's a Hole. He omits info that hurts his argument in some fashion. :)




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