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When you recruit 3 star athletes... O'brien will always fight up hill battle

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  • hovis Nov 7, 6:08 p.m.
    All Star

    The website he posted has NCSU from 07-13 5th, twice 6th, twice 10th and once at 12th.... View More

    — Posted by packalum10

    This years recruiting class does not have much impact on next years football team or to lesser... View More

    — Posted by hovis

    I do not know where you saw that I was pointing at the recruiting class affecting next years... View More

    — Posted by packalum10

    Sorry. Only quoted you because I meant to mention how hilarious that link was. Comment actually intended for the comment you were responding to the NCSU current recruiting rank.

  • packalum10 Nov 7, 5:55 p.m.
    Veteran

    The website he posted has NCSU from 07-13 5th, twice 6th, twice 10th and once at 12th.... View More

    — Posted by packalum10

    This years recruiting class does not have much impact on next years football team or to lesser... View More

    — Posted by hovis

    I do not know where you saw that I was pointing at the recruiting class affecting next years team. I only was pointing to the fact that in the last few years that the Pack has been as good as 5th, but as bad as last in the ACC in recruiting.

  • buckets112 Nov 7, 5:32 p.m.
    Sports Legend

    It's a totally different situation for Grobe. Wake Forest knew how he was going to do things... View More

    — Posted by Juice E Fruit

    I think you can expect it, and demand it, and get rid of coaches who don't deliver it. But at... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    interesting last paragraph. so you're saying that state should accept mediocrity, never strive... View More

    — Posted by buckets112

    I'm not saying what State should or should not do. They can strive all they want. I'm saying th... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    i respect your opinion and see your point. it does seem like an endeavor of futility to try to improve state's fball program.

    i'm just glad that the folks in charge of the athletic dept don't think that way. otherwise sendek and mike o'cain would still be here, the volleyball team that didn't win a conf match in several years wouldn't be sitting in 4th place right now, and the softball/wrestling/soccer teams would be wasting away with coaches that were taking the teams nowhere.

    i'd rather keep aiming high and failing all the time. it's better than being unwilling to improve or take risks...living comfortably...going unnoticed...in just being good enough. boo.

  • hovis Nov 7, 5:27 p.m.
    All Star

    It's a totally different situation for Grobe. Wake Forest knew how he was going to do things... View More

    — Posted by Juice E Fruit

    I think you can expect it, and demand it, and get rid of coaches who don't deliver it. But at... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    interesting last paragraph. so you're saying that state should accept mediocrity, never strive... View More

    — Posted by buckets112

    I'm not saying what State should or should not do. They can strive all they want. I'm saying th... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    I think this all goes back to a fans definition of success. If it is unreasonable you are sure to be disappointed. To say that state has not succeeded would depend on the definition of success.

    Growing up as a UNC fan that actually went to the game and not to the Wal-Mart hat rack I view it all like this. I came into every season with high hopes. Maybe even unreasonable ones sometimes. But Dick Crum (as hard as he tried) never ran me off. We struggled and I do not care who you are when you are in the midst of a 2 win season you sometimes look around when the score is 44-3 and wonder what in the h^&% you are doing at the game. But I saw very taented kids play football and I pulled for my team even when the odds were long/impossible and held on. We knew that the program was doing all that it could to get better and as a fan that is all that we asked.
    Then Mack Brown came.
    I watched the team that I had pulled for when they were TERRIBLE,become good and pull off some of the most memorable things in football history. I will never, ever forget those high points or the struggle it took to get there.
    I am sure that NCSU fans can directly relate to this from the Amatto era.
    I would not trade those low points if it meant that I never was to experience the high ones.
    Now I wait again. Will either of our schools reach our high points again? I do not know for sure. But I will stay a fan till the day I die on one condition.

    When they quit trying, they will get no more from me.

  • Metta World Biff Nov 7, 5:13 p.m.
    Sports Legend

    It's a crapshoot. If you hire the right guy you win. Mack had UNC knocking on the door. Ranked #4 and 11-1. Then left for Texas and won the big one. He was the right guy. UNC and State were good enough to beat Texas before Mack was there. Alabama hired the wrong guy and UNC and State were good enough to beat them. Then they hired the right guy and are unstoppable right now. Yes, they are blue bloods but it takes the right coach. Look at Notre Dame football. Look at UNC basketball. Slipped to 8-20 then hired the right guy and got 2 quick natty's.
    It's all about hitting paydirt with the right coach. Resources certainly help to secure the right guy. On the flip side, hire the wrong guy and you pay dearly for it. Best example is Colorado. When I was in school there in the 90's we recently won a Natty, won 10 games a year like clockwork and were ranked number 1 in the country during my soph year. They even had an encore in 2001 being ranked #2 and going to the Fiesta bowl. But they hired the wrong guy and it's turned into a 7 year debacle of a program that can't beat a high school team.
    It's all a crapshoot. Kansas St before Snyder is the best example of that. For a good laugh, research the K State football program before Snyder.
    There's no reason why State, UNC or anybody else should expect to be mediocre when a shot at something better is out there.

  • Ken D. Nov 7, 4:56 p.m.
    Sports Legend

    It's a totally different situation for Grobe. Wake Forest knew how he was going to do things... View More

    — Posted by Juice E Fruit

    I think you can expect it, and demand it, and get rid of coaches who don't deliver it. But at... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    interesting last paragraph. so you're saying that state should accept mediocrity, never strive... View More

    — Posted by buckets112

    I'm not saying what State should or should not do. They can strive all they want. I'm saying that I don't believe that State will ever consistently be much better than they are, and have been for as long as I can remember. I am saying that State has, in fact, been striving to be more for all those years. They have been striving their brains out. They haven't succeeded. Therefore, they continue to be unhappy. They didn't just start to be unhappy. They have been unhappy for years. And I'm betting they will continue to be unhappy - at least most of the time - in the future. Because, unlike Wake Forest, they think they should be better.

    As Berta on the sitcom Two and a Half Men said to Alan: "Zippy, life is a lot easier once you've figured out if you're the pin or the cushion". I just don't think State has figured it out yet.

  • hovis Nov 7, 3:35 p.m.
    All Star

    It's a totally different situation for Grobe. Wake Forest knew how he was going to do things... View More

    — Posted by Juice E Fruit

    I think you can expect it, and demand it, and get rid of coaches who don't deliver it. But at... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    interesting last paragraph. so you're saying that state should accept mediocrity, never strive... View More

    — Posted by buckets112

    I agree with you buckets as long as everyone is willing to pay the price the rebuilding takes. I do not think that Stoops or Meyers are the best coaches that you can have if given the choice anyway. No one thought that Frank Beamer would ever stay this long at VaTech and look at what he accomplished. Everyone (and I do mean everyone) wanted Grobe from Wake in his early years but he stayed. It does not happen often and Carolina and State have had coaches use us as stepping stones but I think that if you can luck out and get that coach that is coming up from FCS or a small program to stay and build a program around you really have the best thing that you can really wish for outside of changing the school name to Alabama.

  • buckets112 Nov 7, 1:41 p.m.
    Sports Legend

    It's a totally different situation for Grobe. Wake Forest knew how he was going to do things... View More

    — Posted by Juice E Fruit

    I think you can expect it, and demand it, and get rid of coaches who don't deliver it. But at... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    interesting last paragraph. so you're saying that state should accept mediocrity, never strive to be anything better than what they've been in the past, and continue on as a middling team in a bcs conference. that is completely and utterly asinine. i'm sure bill snyder at kansas state would disagree with that mentality as well. if state's goal isn't to improve, but just maintain, i'd rather they do away with the fball program completely.

    all teams, even traditional powerhouses, have been through lean times...finding the right guy for the job could take a few yrs or in state's case, decades. state does face some serious obstacles in finding "the guy." they'll never be able to pull in a big time already successful coach like the urban meyers and bob stoops of the world...state doesn't have brand name recognition like a 'bama, nor is it considered a destination job. their best bet is likely to hire a young up and comer from a non bcs school or maybe even FCS. the gamble paid off with the likes of meyer and brian kelly. the problem will be keeping the guy if he's successful.

  • hovis Nov 7, 1:08 p.m.
    All Star

    It's a totally different situation for Grobe. Wake Forest knew how he was going to do things... View More

    — Posted by Juice E Fruit

    I think you can expect it, and demand it, and get rid of coaches who don't deliver it. But at... View More

    — Posted by Ken D.

    True. When you change coaches sometimes it even prolongs the agony even if it is a good hire because of decommits and the temporary advantage this gives to your local opponents. But it is the price that you must be willing to pay if you wish to get your team to the place you feel they should be. State basketball is a great example of that. They are back in the national picture. That is not luck, there was alot of pain and suffering and hard decisions to make all through that process to reach the current level. Whether or not the level is reasonable or not is continuously debatable. However if you persevere you will likely get there. It took 30 years for it to reach a level that nearly all State fans would agree it should be. A lot of that was a 20+ year coaching search. The real question there is would you have rather competed for the ACC on more occasions in that span or be in the national picture?
    Not meant to imply that State is expects to get into the national picture in football. Just meant to compare the expectations and the wait for them to be fulfilled.

  • kato_karma.v3 Nov 7, 10:00 a.m.
    Sports Legend

    Excellent 2 posts Juice.

    Tough call for Yow/NCSU, but one that needs to be addressed if the Pack football program is to take the next step.

    Given that hindsight is 20/20, UNC's post-Mack coaching decisions to go with Torbush, Bunting, and Davis have left us Heel fans with 14 years of funk -- the first 2 simply could not coach and the latter one tainted the program with academic/character woes.

    Still too early to tell, but Fedora seems to have the coaching acumen along with the ability to relate to the younger recruits (and fans).

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